Low recording input level

[mightymic]

polywave,
i'm not a techie, but i bought a new digital sound card from tracer, and i really panicked when i saw the low output levels. it is recording into my DC 6 at right at -20 dB's. i called tracer in a panic because with an analog card at that low level the sound is very muddy, and of poor quality. however with the new digital card it comes in at -20 dB's and it is just a clear and clean as can be. after recording i boost it up to about 75 to 80 % or "normal" work with the tracks and then the last step is the gain increase up to full volume.

long story short i've had no problems with the low level at all.

[Craig Maier]

mightymic -

That kind of makes sense, especially if you are recording with 24 bits of resolution which has 144 dB of dynamic range. By recording at -20 dB, you still have 124 dB of total dynamic range which is still 28 dB more dynamic range than a Red Book CD has.

[polywave]

Thanks for the feedback Mightymic.

I FINALLY got my system to record with the Juli@ installed. I have to feed nearly all the gain from my PT3 into it to get it to record at about -14dB peak (about 8 volts according to the B&K specifications, and assuming I'm putting maximum input voltage into the PT3).

That part I can live with, in fact, the higher the input, the greater the signal-noise ratio going into the sound card and the happier I am.

But.
Installing the Juli@ still breaks my ability to adjust the volume and mute through the OS. That part is still a major pain in the but, because to work around it I think I have to have the Juli@ control panel running and adjust it there (instead of from my keyboard or the volume control in the lower right hand corner).
Not only that, I can record only from Line In, so I can't capture "What I Hear", like radio stations playing my favorite old songs in the middle of the night!

So.
The Juli@ is sitting here in it's box waiting to be returned, or for some awesome information to fall out of the sky so that I can re-install it.

BTW:
I purchased the Juli@ from DJDeals.com. They refuse to take it back because, as they put it, "why would they want my used equipment?" just because I changed my mind.
Well, if the card would work with XP like DJDeals said it would, I wouldn't be totally dissapointed right now, but intead on my way to conjuring up a balanced preamp to complete this endeavor.

[Craig Maier]

Do you know if the Julie@ level was able to be adjusted via the output side of Diamond Cuts multifilter? That may be a useful piece of information for the soundcard manufacturer if it did. I suspect that they have a bug or maybe two in their driver.

As for signal levels, could it be that you are using one of the low output level phono cartridges that are on the market? That would contribute to the low preamp output level - - - in other words, your preamp may not be developing anywhere near 8 Volts output because of the low input level that it is being presented with.

At the end of the day, keep in mind that vinyl LP's only have, at best, 60 dB S/N. Equipment that exceed that level of performance are working against the law of diminishing returns.

[polywave]

Hi Craig,
I'm using an MM cartridge, I've read that the MM puts out 3mV. Compared to the MC cartridge, I suppose that's high output. Anyways, the Pyle Pro preamp's phono input specification is 3mV/47K, and I think that's compatable with the MM cartridge.

I received a response from ESI regarding the way the Juli@ works with XP's volume and mute features :

'you would not use the windows volume and mutes with the juli@ card you would need to use the juli@ control panel for all these things.'

Fabrice Ortiz
Tech Support
ESI America

Looks to me like they like the way it works, so I'm not holding my breath for any changes here...

Soooo....they probably aren't interested in your info on the output side of Diamond Cuts multifilter.

I'm currenlty disputing the charges on the Juli@. I don't know if DJDeals.com has seller protection from PayPal, but probably. If so they were paid by PayPal and aren't entitled to the sound card, and I seriously doubt PayPal would want it.

If it turns out that the credit card company doesn't pay PayPal, then I feel it's the right thing to somehow dispose of the card as I would not be entitled to it either (perhaps StVincent DePaul at the bottom of the hill could use it).

If it turns out that the credit card company does pay PayPal, then I will sell it to recover some of my costs.

So went my little adventure into the new way

[Craig Maier]

I just want to point out that some MM cartridges develop as little as 0.5 mV.

Sorry to hear of your woes regarding the Julie@ soundcard. Personally, I have no experience with it but for what you have shared with us here on the bbs.