Mentor Doesn't Remove Pops from File

[MusicMan]

For the past several days I've been trying out Mentor and Millennium, trying to decide which one I will purchase for transferring some of my LP's to CD. Last night I recorded and processed a file with Mentor but was disappointed when I listened to about half of the file today and found loud pops still in the file. I thought removing record noise (pops, clicks, scratches) was what Mentor was good at doing. I think I followed the instructions in TW correctly but I'm wondering if somehow I did something wrong. Any suggestions?

[Geebster]

You probably didn't do anything wrong. This is where the more full featured Diamond Cut products such as Millennium and DC6 shine. It may sound strange, but sometimes the larger impulses (crackle, scratch) are the hardest to remove. However, within Millennium (and other DC full feature products) you can highlight a small area of the waveform where the impulse occurs and then hit the " i " key (interpolate) and the larger impulses will be removed.

You will find that no one filter will work for all sonic problems and impulses are no exception. Sometimes you will have to run a filter multiple times (with differing settings) to get the results you desire.

Don't be afraid to experiment a little, especially in this time where you are trying to decide which package (Mentor vs. Millennium) is best for you.

GB

[Craig Maier]

If you use the following procedure, it should be effective:

1. Put all the de-noiser sliders to zero (fully to the right).

2. While previewing, slowly move the "Scratch" slider upwards (towards the left) until the big impulses are removed, but the little ones are still there.

3. Next, move the "Crackle" slider upwards (again, towards the left) until the small impulsive noise is removed.

4. After those two controls are set, now move the "Hiss" slider upwards slowly until the very tiny clicks and hiss are attenuated to your satisfaction. This control has a few seconds of latency as the routine adapts to the signal, so be patient and allow it to do its math before advancing the control again. In other words, move it a little bit, then wait two seconds and then move it again until you are satisfied with the result.

I hope that this helps.

Note: The three moving bar graphs will show you when noises are being removed. If the graphics are nailed all the way up, then you probably have adjusted their controls too agressively (too far towards the left).

[Geebster]

I think Mentor's de-noising scheme is more sophisticated than my brain!! I don't know if there is any value to this whatsoever, but I like running the filters in seperate passes, rather than tackling all of the noise in one shot.

This is probably just me, but I tend to want to move the sliders too agressively when trying to get rid of all of the unwanted noise in one pass. And I tend to use more restraint initially with each pass when I use the multible pass approach.

There may be absolutely no validity in this approach; maybe if I just would take the time to set the sliders correctly at first I could get perfect results with one pass. But at least for me, I notice an improvement if I first remove the large impulses; then the smaller ones; and finally take care of the constant noise (hiss). I have A/B'd my results and whether it is real or imagined, it seems that my multiple pass files sound better with no introduction of artifacts into the file.

GB

[Craig Maier]

It is true that multiple passes through the Mentor de-noiser filter is mathematically different than running a single pass with more agressive settings. In some cases, multiple passes could theoretically yield better results whereas in some other cases it could be the other way around. But, for certain, the result will be different using multiple passes.

[Geebster]

In some cases, multiple passes could theoretically yield better results whereas in some other cases it could be the other way around. But, for certain, the result will be different using multiple passes.

Mmmm.... At least with my source material, I don't think I've ever run across a case where the single pass method was superior to a multiple pass one. I've had many, many cases where I compared 2 files done; one with a single pass and one with multiple passes and they sounded just about the same.

Would there be any rule of thumb to where the single pass method would be superior on certain source material?

I thought I had a handle on the filters within Mentor, now I'm not so certain!!!

GB

[Craig Maier]

GB -

I can only say that digital artifacting could be increased with multiple passes in theory. But, we have not run scientific tests comparing the actual results using both methods in Mentor. I would recommend the use of whatever method works the best for you and your material and forget about the theory. After all, the proof of the pudding is in its eating.

[Geebster]

Thanks Craig.... That's what I have been doing; letting my ears be the judge. And usually I reserve Mentor for the vinyl I know that won't need much clean-up work. I still use DC6 for the majority of the clean-up in most situations because it is more flexible, but it is so nice to have both!!

GB

[MusicMan]

Mentor Doesn't Remove Pops From File

Thanks, guys, for your comments and suggestions. I'll give them a try tonight or on the weekend. I'm leaning towards Millennium at this point but I, too, think it would be ideal to have both Mentor and Millennium. Perhaps a few months down the road for the second one. Will let you know what the results are.

By the way, what's the story on the trial period for Mentor. I see two different times on the web site. At one point it indicates you can try it for 30 days and then another place it says five days. It would seem that the latter time is in effect as I received a notice just a short while ago that I have only 44 hours left on Mentor. I installed it Monday.